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Our Shared Ongoing Battle To Not Buy A Tesla

Like you, I am pretty much resigned to the fact that I’m going to have to buy a Tesla at some point.

I can tell because I have read every last scrap of Tesla news and inadvertently memorized every last technical detail about the company and their cars and energy storage systems that has ever been printed or YouTubed. Since about 2012. When this happens to me for any product, whether it’s a new laptop or a different vehicle  or a house in a certain neighborhood, I usually end up buying it.

The purchase tends to happen when the list of justifications builds up to a tipping point where it starts to seem sensible. For the Tesla, these justifications are things like:

  • “I strongly support the company and its mission. Unlike almost any other big company on Earth, Tesla exists primarily to help out the human race. Surely worth a few of my spare bucks, right?”
  • “I can afford to buy it in cash without having to go back to work or anything extreme like that.”
  • “It’s the best car AND the best piece of technology in the world, and at least ten years ahead of the next best. Shouldn’t a lifelong tech expert like myself be taking a peek at the future?”
  • “It would be a lower-pollution way to replace some of my air travel, as the only car that can drive itself most of the time on long highway trips. PLUS, imagine the road trips I could take with my son! Mammoth Caves National Park! Lifetime Memories just like I have with my own Dad!”
  • “They are reasonably priced these days at “only” about $39k for a new Model 3 and even lower for a used Model S.”

In the past, my mind has made up similar justifications for other purchases like, “this lovely camera will help you create more engaging pictures for the blog.”, “this drywall hoist will save you a lot of time”, “you will make a profit by owning this high-end new laptop because it will encourage you to write more.”

And it’s not just me. As I’ve talked to more and more people about this, I find that most of us have some sort of Purchase Justification Machine running in the background of our minds. The PJM’s effects can range from very useful, like a carpenter buying a nailgun which will be used every day to make money, to completely disastrous, like the office worker who buys a $40,000 8-passenger Honda Pilot for his 12,000 annual miles of mostly empty driving on smooth roads, because “I need to make sure I can get to work in the winter, too.”

I like to fancy my own PJM as being at least a bit better than average, after all I have always maintained a slightly-less-ridiculous level of spending than the average middle class worker. Most of the things it has talked me into buying have indeed been things like nailguns or reasonably good quality clothing that just happens to be from Costco or the thrift shop.

Yes, there was once a brand-new $13,000* Honda VFR800 sport motorbike which destroys a lot of my credibility, but that was in 2001 long before Mr. Money Mustache was born.

But I can TELL that it is really grasping at straws when it tries to justify that Tesla. And that’s why I thankfully still don’t have a Tesla.

The PJM has done its work well, but I try to stay ahead of it by tossing in my own list of objections, like throwing gnarly stumps into a wood chipping machine to slow it down.

  • “You don’t even have anywhere to drive that Tesla, dude! If you had a mandatory 20-mile commute and absolutely could not move closer to your six-figure job, that would be one thing. But you’re retired and you bike everywhere, so a car is only for camping and hiking trips. Wait until you are further along in the child-raising project and have more free time to take off for month-long road trips.”
  • “You can’t just leave a $40,000 car out in the searing Colorado sun to bake and fade and collect birdshit, but you also don’t want to sacrifice an entire bay of your tidy workshop garage for a car. So you need to at least wait until you build that master bedroom deck which doubles as a carport, right? So you’d better get out the post-hole digger before you sign into the Tesla Design Studio.”
  • “No matter how much you use that car, it will always cost more per mile than cross country air travel even with full carbon offsets. So don’t get lured in by the nearly-free nature of electric car charging.”
  • “Make sure you try it before you buy it. Rent a Tesla from Turo or from a friend and try your first road trip. If you still crave one after that first thrill wears off, then we can talk.”

See what’s happening here? In order to keep ahead of the relentless efficiency of my Purchase Justification Machine, I just need to throw up nice, rational roadblocks to slow it down.

But the reason this is so effective is that I’m not just flat-out denying myself that Tesla. It’s pretty hard to tell yourself that NO, you can never have what you want. Instead, I’m just telling myself what things need to happen first, before clicking “buy” on the Tesla website.

And if these things are healthy, happy things (raising my son, getting other labor-intensive projects done with my own hands, and planning a great future series of camping and roadtrips), I divert my attention into living a good life right now, instead of doing the easy thing which is just buying myself another treat.

And the further I can delay this or any purchase, the longer my money can remain productively invested in stocks, and the more it prevents my PJM from locking its greedy crosshairs onto the next little lifestyle “upgrade” that it will find.

But this trick is not just for jaw-dropping electric sports cars. You can use it almost anywhere in your own life.

Kicking the Kitchen Down the Road

A friend of mine loves to cook, and has been pining for a kitchen upgrade for many years to make this activity more enjoyable. And I can’t blame him – his kitchen is indeed dated, as is the rest of the house. But he’s also in debt and not climbing out very quickly. And too busy to do the kitchen upgrade work himself, because work and kids suck up all his time. Should he allow himself to upgrade this kitchen?

Yes!

BUT only after meeting a carefully considered list of conditions:

  • Quit Cable TV, Netflix, Hulu, Facebook, Twitter, video games, and other time drains. Because getting three hours of life back each day will give you more time to address other shortages in life.
  • Make sure you’re getting in at least an hour of outdoor walking and/or cycling every day. Plus, regular weight training. The joy of a new kitchen is nothing compared to the benefits of getting your heart, muscles and mind in better shape.
  • Use another hour of each day for cleaning, organizing and optimizing the house you already have. Is every drawer in the kitchen well-organized? Could you get more space by hanging up the pots and pans? Adding one of those large but simple heavy duty rolling islands with butcherblock top from Costco? What about just a super nice faucet for 80 bucks and a couple of nice track lights?**
  • How about the rest of the house? Are  the closets well-organized with optimal shelving? Is the garage spotless? Carpets DIY steam cleaned and rooms patched and painted nicely? Gardens and lawn tidy and peaceful?
  • How about the finances? Have you checked around for lower mortgage rates, home and car insurance, mobile phone plans, and canceled any unused subscriptions? Ask your friends what rates they are paying for all these things, switch to the best option, and you cut your bills by $500 per month, which will add up to pay for a kitchen pretty quickly.

See, instead of being constantly depressed because it will be years until you can afford that kitchen, you use it as a trigger to get busy and improve your entire life right now. Which gives you the feelings of happiness and control that were making you crave that kitchen in the first place. Or that Tesla.

And on that note, I am going to get out there and start measuring the post locations for my new deck.

Epilogue!

The very day after I published this, I went down to visit a friend in Broomfield to chat and borrow some of his spare video gear (to help me delay purchasing my own, of course!)

But what should I find in his driveway, but a BRAND NEW Tesla model 3, long range all wheel drive in the same glowing red color shown above, which he had just picked up the day before.

I gave him the whole interview on why he bought it, because I know he doesn’t commute to work and has no need for a fancy car either.

They were the same reasons that I had listed above – he’s mostly curious about the future of technology, wanted to support it, and knows that Tesla is it. If it weren’t for Tesla’s existence, he would be perfectly content with a 15-year-old Honda. This company is really pulling out a unique set of buyers that no other car company could ever entice.

So we took it for a test drive. My diagnosis: very similar to the Nissan Leaf in interior size and tight, silent driving feel for standard urban driving – except much more artistic inside and out, and so fast that you literally start to lose consciousness and get dizzy under full acceleration. Kinda silly, but the very existence of cars is silly so you might as well embrace it.

Oh! And unlike the Leaf, when you fold down the rear seats and climb inside, it is plenty big and flat to sleep two people, which makes it a passable road trip mini-camper, even without a proper hatchback.


In the Comments: what is YOUR Purchase Justification Machine trying to make you buy? Have you already bought the Model 3 or are you still milking the 2010 Prius for all it’s worth? How long are you going to push your current smartphone until you allow yourself to replace it? Sharing your battles will give others the strength to keep their own procrastination game strong.


* I forked over $10,000 of my hard-earned cash as a 26-year-old kid in the year 2001, which is about $14,000 if you adjust it for inflation to 2019. But motor vehicles prices have risen slower than general inflation over recent decades, so I split the difference a bit here. But any way you slice it, this was a foolish purchase on my part!

** I linked to those because I have been using that particular track light everywhere in recent years – headquarters, home, and other projects. Way nicer quality/style than the options at Home Depot despite lower price. These LED bulbs are great for it as well.

  • Josh Zukewich May 9, 2019, 7:03 am

    I drive a 92 civic that came with a parts car and 3 sets of tires for $1000. It looks beat up to all hell and I love it. I can also take it down logging roads (carefully) to hike or climb and strap overly large things to it’s roof for building projects. I love that machine.

    TBH I haven’t run any numbers, but my hunch is each additional year I can get out of that thing and not buy a new electric vehicle is a win for the environment. Every year I keep that thing out of the landfill and push off the necessity of manufacturing a new thing likely more than offsets the small amount of gas the civic consumes relative to an electric counterpart. I can still even work on it myself since it’s not overly computerized.

    My PJM is usually working to get me to buy nicer tools, or build projects that seem neat but perhaps I don’t really need. I try to tell myself that if I really want a stack of nice lumber I can wait until some company or other overbuys and sells it for cheap. A detached shop WOULD really make my building projects easier and I would be so much more efficient…. but… crap… there it goes. If I haven’t tended the garden, made some food, gone climbing this week, and spent time with my partner then do I really have time and money to build a shop?

    Reply
  • David May 9, 2019, 7:13 am

    Great article. My PJM is mainly, my wife/kids will be happy which is priceless.
    For myself I really dread buying stuff as I don’t typically enjoy new things that much and really don’t like owning things as it means taking care of them and storing them etc.

    For the Tesla you should calculate cost per trip and then decide if you want to buy one. The battery will degrade not so much with use but with time, so having it sit there while you do nothing is a huge waste. For me I’m hoping autonomous driving will get off the ground soon and there will be a fleet of self-driving cars that are available on request.
    Maybe if you must buy one you could buy one and start renting it out. Then not only are you supporting Tesla and driving cleaner, you also enable others to drive cleaner. If self-driving is ever realized fully, it could actually make money for you.

    Reply
  • Dan May 9, 2019, 7:24 am

    Badly want a Go Fast Camper (truck canopy that pops up into a tent, made in Bozeman, super-cool!) and a (used) truck to put it on, but we already have a perfectly functional car, and this camping rig would get used maybe 2-3 weeks a year. We’re probably going to rent one this summer though…

    Reply
  • E May 9, 2019, 7:49 am

    Try to think about Elon Musk’s epic jerk moments (like when he called the diver who helped rescue that Thai boy’s soccer team a pedophile) when you get really tempted

    To be clear, I don’t usually let jerk-founders/executives keep me from buying products, but if it helps you…

    Reply
    • Mr. Money Mustache May 9, 2019, 8:28 pm

      Yep, while I do understand and agree with almost of all of what Elon says (and feel the media often drastically misunderstands and misquotes him), there are a few things including this cave diver thing that I could never figure out. Also, his spontaneous firings of well-meaning engineers during emotional outbursts.

      I can’t cast ANY judgement, not knowing him in person… but from the outside some of these things seem like momentary fractures of reasonable behavior, maybe caused by some combination of genius and stress.

      Even as a non-genius with a much less stressful life I can see my own mind getting pretty crazy in its weaker moments, so I could imagine that being more pronounced if you amp everything up. Still, he definitely means the best for the world and is very effective at getting things done, which is worth cutting him some slack and trying to help out.

      Reply
  • Chuck May 9, 2019, 7:54 am

    My wife and I struggle with Tesla PJM constantly. Our battered ’07 Fit finally croaked in February and we challenged ourselves to try to go car-free. Between public transit, the occasional Lyft/Zipcar ride, and of course bikes we have not been inconvenienced a bit. Actually the challenge of biking to places we’d normally drive (friends’ houses, etc) has been great fun.

    So we don’t NEED a car… And certainly not an expensive one. For years I’ve been the buzzkill shaking my head at fancy BMWs scraping over potholes or collecting salt stains in the winter. “Fools!” I mutter to myself, “Why drop a grand on a car that Boston’s notorious roads and weather will chew up and spit out?”

    And yet… ever since we lost dear Barb (the Fit), Tesla.com has been showing up in my browser history with increasing frequency…

    I’m hoping we manage to stay car-free until we have kids. After that, all bets are off. The next vehicle will be electric, that’s for sure!

    Reply
    • Mr. Money Mustache May 9, 2019, 8:49 am

      You have a great point – Boston and cars are a terrible mix.

      I was already aghast when I heard words like “battered” and “finally” applied to a RIDICULOUSLY BRAND-NEW CAR like a 2007 Honda Fit! For comparison, my 1999 Honda van is still almost brand new and yet to get its first bit of visible rust. Out of the 140,000 miles on the odometer, only 27k are mine from these past eight years of bliss together :-)

      So YES, you should tell yourself that you can get a Tesla as soon as you move to a car-friendly climate, and even then you may never need it because you’ll choose a walkable neighbourhood in the future, AND they will be autonomous and rentable by then!

      Reply
      • bh May 10, 2019, 8:59 pm

        crazy off topic question… but you seem to know a alot about odyssey… I have a 2009 honda odyssey with 165k km (not miles) I have never replaced the timing belt and a few people have told me if it goes it would destroy the engine.. should I replace the timing belt?

        Reply
        • Mark June 23, 2019, 7:59 pm

          YES
          At that age and mileage you are running a significant risk.

          Reply
  • Travis May 9, 2019, 7:54 am

    A new kitchen is my PJM. I’m the family cook and I dream of spending my future years in an efficient and lovely space where I practice my craft. Or so I tell myself to justify getting a 36” range with six burners.

    FYI. Speaking of Mammoth Cave, We live an hour away and would love to offer free room, meals, camping gear, transportation (we have an extra car, long story) in return for friendly conversation and kitchen construction advice.

    Reply
  • Erin May 9, 2019, 7:59 am

    We purchased a CPO Model S two years ago after saving for four years. We save $250+ per month on gas commuting to Denver. We absolutely love our Tesla. We have free supercharging too. I’ll never go back to an ICE vehicle.

    Reply
  • PaiMeiStash May 9, 2019, 8:03 am

    Alarm bells on my PJM went bizzerk after looking at diamond rings and then learning about their history in our culture.

    Reply
  • Jonathan May 9, 2019, 8:18 am

    My PJM has been after camping equipment lately, especially when I made the decision to relocate to the Norwegian fjordlands to work on a Master’s degree to further my career, putting me right next door to hundreds of flawless, permit-free campsites. The big one it wants to get is a nice large tent, but a bushcraft knife, axe, new backpack, compression bags, the list goes on.

    Found an unused gift card leftover from Christmas and got myself some paracord and a stainless steel cookpot to satiate the PJM. The paracord, thanks to some helpful YouTube videos, now doubles as a compression bag for my sleeping bag and bedroll AND can lash those things to my well-worn standard backpack. The cookpot, while a bit more specialized, has found plenty of use on the BBQ already, mostly to make or heat sauces. I’ll still likely go in for a tent when I get to Norway this summer (especially for winter camping when warmth and dryness will be at a premium), but it’ll be a craigslist one. For now, some old painters tarps and my 100ft of paracord have been just fine for shelters. Nothing like shutting the PJM up with learning a few new skills!

    Reply
  • Treller May 9, 2019, 8:30 am

    I waited in line to place my reservation on the car 3 years ago at 5 in the morning. I have been obsessed with Tesla since before the Model S so much so I bought stock at $25.
    We finally bought the Model 3 at the end of March upgrading from a 2005 Jetta.
    Gas is $4+ in CA and my stock gains almost bought the car but that’s all my PJM working, the gains are the gains which I could have kept, I spent them and the gas savings will never make sense as I could return more from an index fund with half the principal I paid for the car. (We were strongly considering a Nissan Leaf which would have more than met our needs at half the price of the model 3).
    Bottom line, we are FIRE and the car is amazing and it truly makes me very happy and I think it will for years to come. There are a few times in life you have to just do it, we are very glad we did!

    Reply
  • The Frug May 9, 2019, 8:34 am

    I’m surrounded by water. The Chesapeake Bay, Potomac River, lots of lakes and streams. Every few years I get what’s called the boat itch. I’ve even found myself watching sailing and van life videos on YouTube. I would never buy a new boat, but occasionally the lonely unused boats in nearby Marinas catch my eye as I’m cruising by on my bike.

    I just remember why that Marina is always full. It’s because their owners are too busy working to pay for those boats to enjoy them. It turns out the boat itch is pretty easy to scratch. I just run the numbers using this handy real cost of boat ownership tool from Sailo. The 10-year boat ownership costs versus investing that money never cease to amaze me and make it easy to figure out much better ways to get out on the water. https://www.sailo.com/calculator#sailo_boat_calculator_tab_sub_costs

    Reply
  • DenverVisionary May 9, 2019, 8:42 am

    Timely article MMM! I had a suspicion you would write one of these shortly after I had a chance to talk to you about leafs and teslas during the Playing with Fire documentary early screening. You seemed very passionate about teslas as well.

    Like others, I am also struggling with this decision. I currently have a 2013 leaf and an Odyssey for my 3 kids. Unfortunately, I was bitten by the battery degradation issues that are common in leafs, having lost 4 bars (3000 miles after warranty, no less) which translates to about 30-35% of the total capacity lost. While it is more than sufficient for my daily commute of 12 miles, going to Denver and back from Colorado springs is a bit of a challenge. I was surprised to find my wife trying to convince me to buy a used model s now, instead of delaying that purchase until the end of the year, when we’ve had the chance to save more money towards a house down payment. It was very tempting, but I was able to convince her to hold off a bit longer in the end. Cheers!!

    Reply
  • Jason Bloomberg May 9, 2019, 8:54 am

    Interesting perspectives. As more become available in the secondary market and the reduced operating costs become better known from more drivers the monetary rationalizations to not buy one will diminish.

    My PJM has a “balance sheet” which considers nonmonetary factors as well as monetary. We have been driving electric since 2007 and have integrated renewable energy into our homes since the 1980’s. Our PJM includes a paradigm to make environmentally beneficial choices within our financial reach even if it means it is a stretch.

    Here is a link to our EVs: http://www.evalbum.com/1949

    Like almost every car we’ve ever owned we bought our 2012 P85 Tesla Model S used from Tesla with 19,200 miles on it in 2016 for about half its original price and with a 4 year/50,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty and remainder of the 8 year unlimited miles warranty. We just crossed 104,000 miles and our maintenance and repair costs not including tires has totaled ~$1,200 of which $500 was an upgrade to 4G-LTE which was completely optional. Our battery has lost some range. The rated range has dropped from 256 rated mikes to 252. I had the brakes checked and thanks to regenerative braking the technician reports “they look new”.

    We use it mostly for long distance travel and it has been very reliable. At home we mske our own fuel with wind turbines and solar PV.

    Compared to the costs of operation for our previous I.C.E. (internal combustion engine) powered vehicles electric vehicles last longer, cost less, and iver their service life which is much longer, are less damaging to the environment.

    In 2012 this car sold for $107,000 A similar version with similar mileage to oyrs can be obtained for about $35,000. No doubt in a couple of years used Tesla Model 3 will be available in the $20,000 price range.

    While I think things like Tesla’s Supercharger network, driver assist technology (“autopilot”), mechanical simplicity, and general performance make it preferable to other EVs, I still think almost any EV is a better long term choice than an I.C.E. machine. 😎

    Reply
  • Matt May 9, 2019, 9:00 am

    We are literally continuing to drive our 2010 Prius with just over 160k until it’s truly time for a Tesla. We know that day will come at some point. We are a two car household at the moment, we also have a 2014 BMW i3 full electric model that I feel we got a decent deal on used at $15.5k. It’s a world better than the old Jeep Cherokee that it replaced, but is child’s play compared to a Tesla.

    Our thinking is that we will sell both vehicles and purchase a Tesla when we go down to one vehicle post FI. Future long distance road trips sound pretty awesome, along with the ability to bring our dog with us, skipping the plane flights!

    Reply
  • Taconite May 9, 2019, 9:00 am

    My PJM is trying to get me to buy a whole bunch of camping gear for my son’s cub scout events. The primary argument I have against it is that we are a family of 4 in a stuffed small condo, so I have no space to really store all the stuff when not in use.
    I too want a newer car; I have a 2009 Ford Fusion with 90K miles on it and would love to replace it with an used plug-in. Arguments against, I carpool several times a week, I am not FI yet and I don’t want to whittle down my savings to purchase one.. oh, and the buildings garage has no charging spots.

    Reply
  • dave May 9, 2019, 9:17 am

    You don’t see many cars broken down on the side of the road these days. But the ones I have seen were Teslas. I’ll wait until they iron the bugs out of electrics. Could take 5 more years or so

    Reply
  • Melissa May 9, 2019, 9:21 am

    I’ve been holding off on new carpets. Are carpet was stained when we moved in, but I have little kids who spill constantly and a yard full of manual labor projects to take up my time. The problem is that 2 years of hard labor in the yard and I still don’t have all the money saved for the projects I want to do inside that require more of a professional hand (the stuff that needs to look nice like tile and carpet). Too bad that retirement fund is sucking up all my free cash. Nothing I can do to change that. ;)

    Reply
  • Steveark May 9, 2019, 9:46 am

    Some day when they get the range up to say, 500 or 600 miles then I might get one too. But for now they just barely can make my normal hobby job commute round trip and I don’t relish the idea of rolling back into my driveway nearly on electric fumes. There are no charging stations in rural Arkansas so I’d be stuck in a radius of say 40% of the max range from my home charger(I make round trips) and that doesn’t get me to the places I need to go. I don’t think I’m alone, I’ve seen a total of two Tesla’s on the roads I travel out of hundreds of thousands of cars I’ve driven past. When I get to the city they are as common as crows but in rural America, where we drive long distances, they are still just cool toys.

    Reply
  • Pnoy May 9, 2019, 9:58 am

    The only time I’ll buy a Tesla is when the cost of its parts and labor are substantially reduced in price.

    No point in paying for a high tech car with multiple expensive sensors when all your dumbass neighborhood kids can do is simply test out the blindspots of Sentry mode with a baseball bat.

    Reply
  • M&M May 9, 2019, 10:24 am

    Since reading MMM and starting my FI journey, I honestly cringe so hard at spending money that my PJM is silent. The only item on deck is a bamboo steamer for drastically speeding up cooking bao and soup dumplings. But I’m planning to move to the Netherlands, so that bulky/fragile item can wait.

    As far as cars go, I’m hoping my current path and transpo advancements will make my RAV4 the last car I ever own.

    On a side note, I just visited the electronics station at the recycle/landfill to drop off an old printer, very old iPod video, and my burnt-out college laptop. I will remember that pain next time I want a “gadget.”

    Reply
  • Fit DIY Dad May 9, 2019, 10:55 am

    I guess that old April fools post that included buying a Tesla is starting to look less like a joke…

    That’s a big chunk of change when you compound it. But for you it’s not about the money anymore.

    Elon is awesome, but it sounds like he’s got you man-crushed. If you buy it I hope it’s used, since adding to production and sucking up all those resources for something that doesn’t sound like you’ll get much marginal utility out of seem counterproductive in terms of the environment, but we can rationalize almost anything if we “play the tape” over and over again.

    Seriously, will it really offer you more long-term happiness?

    My current PJM is a go-cart project with my son, and I have a long list of things I have to get through before realistically having the time before the rebuild, so still haven’t pulled the trigger.

    Reply
  • Brad May 9, 2019, 10:59 am

    I’m surrounded by water. The Chesapeake Bay, Potomac River, lots of lakes and streams. Every few years I get what’s called the boat itch. I’ve even found myself watching sailing and van life videos on YouTube. I would never buy a new boat, but occasionally the lonely unused boats in nearby Marinas catch my eye as I’m cruising by on my bike.

    I just remember why that Marina is always full. It’s because their owners are too busy working to pay for those boats to enjoy them. It turns out the boat itch is pretty easy to scratch. I just run the numbers using a real cost of boat ownership tool. The 10-year boat ownership costs versus investing that money never cease to amaze me and make it easy to figure out much better ways to get out on the water. sailo.com/calculator

    Reply
  • Jk May 9, 2019, 11:11 am

    Only thing we argue about is books. The counter to the impulse to buy the next one is have yet to finish reading the previous one. Success rate is about 50%.

    Reply
  • LithiumDoesntLikeCold May 9, 2019, 11:31 am

    Heres a comparison of used vs Tesla’s model 3 this guy tried to make. TLDR model 3 wins (less carbon) after 5 years of ownership. Also compares hybrids.

    https://youtu.be/SwxmIYGpbn4

    Reply
  • Greg May 9, 2019, 12:16 pm

    My Purchase Justification Machine is trying to get me to replace my 2003 Nissan with 180k miles. My brain screams, you make a lot of money, you can afford it, and your car is embarrassingly crappy. But I have bigger goals :)

    Reply
  • Ashley May 9, 2019, 12:16 pm

    Don’t forget about the environmental impact of the batteries, which require extensive mining of rare minerals and cannot yet be recycled. Electric vehicles are WAY better than combustion engines. WAY BETTER. But unless you’re replacing a combustion engine, the bike/walk lifestyle is the BEST option.

    Reply
  • Ken May 9, 2019, 12:24 pm

    I can’t wait for you to buy your Tesla! I say that purely because I ordered a -very- early Model S in 2012 and discovered MMM a few months later. The guilt I felt every time I read MMM and the absolute joy I felt every time I drive my Tesla were in direct conflict. That feeling never left all these years, but the joy is so much greater than the guilt that I bought another Tesla last year (Model 3 Performance). The point of life is happiness, and if a car can bring so much joy and comfort to my life, then its a bargain.

    I also actually saved money over our previous gasoline cars in the long run due to much lower operating costs because my wife and i each work about 40 miles away (opposite directions) from our home. And we live in one of the highest cost areas in the country (mid-peninsula, SF Bay Area). Also, if we have two Teslas, five years apart and if we replace each vehicle every 10 years / 250,000 miles, then that would mean I will be buying a new Tesla every 5 years?! I guess I still have plenty to feel guilty about whenever I read MMM.

    Reply
    • Bob May 9, 2019, 5:31 pm

      Exactly, life is about happiness. I bought a Model 3 and absolutely love it. 6~7 of my friends who tried it also bought Tesla cars. Many people don’t know what they missed by not driving the Tesla.

      Reply
  • Bob May 9, 2019, 12:34 pm

    Buy it. Just do.
    I leased an electric Honda Fit 6 years ago and loved the experience. Good for my 40-60 mile daily commute. Became convinced that this technology was doable in the NY metro area. Got a 240 volt charger set up at home. Had to give up the car two years ago and waiting for another electric vehicle. Was not even considering Tesla until they lowered the price and suddenly needed a second car. I ordered the 3 online and have not regretted my decision. I have time-of-day electric metering and pay 7 cents per kilowatt hour so I figure I’m saving around $1000 per year on gas. Maybe in three years there will be cheaper BEVs out there, but do you really want a car from a company that lied about their diesel emissions, or from someone who believes in making a positive impact on the environment?
    BTW, its a blast to drive!

    Reply
  • Robbie G May 9, 2019, 12:35 pm

    This has REALLY helped my PJM https://www.reddit.com/r/investing/comments/949u8r/if_in_2001_you_bought_399_of_apple_stock_instead/

    In 2001, if you bought $399 of Apple Stock instead of buying an iPod for $399, you would now have $62,000! This really resonated with me and has really helped me really evaluate the majority of my not crucial purchases.

    Why give $700 to Tesla or a bank every month, when I could buy $700 worth of S&P 500 Index funds instead? Basically in 10 years I could have a car with 150,000 miles essentially worth nothing, or I could possibly have $125,000 in investments and have a lot more financial and life freedom.

    Reply
    • Bob May 9, 2019, 5:44 pm

      Love your thought process. Saving money and grow it should be a top priority. I used to have that mindset and was able to retire at 40 (saved every dollar and had some luck with investment).

      But I will tell you this Tesla Model 3 is a different beast. If you have to buy a vehicle anyway, go for the Model 3. You will not regret! The total cost of SR+ is $40k, take account for the tax incentives and gasoline saving, it’s real cost is closer to a $26k gasoline car. For those who can afford, the $50k AWD Model 3 is a much better deal.

      Tesla said the drive train is designed to last 1 million miles. Battery is designed to last 300k to 500k miles and you can replace the battery pack later at 5-7k each.

      The cost maybe not as high as you think, the joy is definitely unmatched. You ask any Model 3 owner you will get the same answer.

      Reply
    • Jason July 16, 2019, 8:31 am

      We need an “upvote” button in here! ;)

      Reply
  • Brian May 9, 2019, 12:36 pm

    My PJM is trying to get me to buy a new kitchen faucet even though the old one works fine. So thanks for nothing.

    Reply
  • Even Torske May 9, 2019, 12:36 pm

    You can’t really ever warrant the purchase of a car in that price range. Its not economical, its not beneficial for anyone except Tesla and its shareholders.

    Now of course, accepting that its a dumb purchase but doing it anyway is certaintly a possibility. But if anyone tries to tell me its a logical or reasonable purchase, I can’t help but laugh inside. Its silly and stupid.

    As for this post specifically, I’m glad you haven’t bought one and I hope you never will! :)

    Regards, pretty new MMM follower :-)

    Reply
  • loki_the_bubba May 9, 2019, 12:37 pm

    I have zero desire for a Tesla. But I yearn for a Mercedes E63 AMG Wagon.

    Reply
  • js homer May 9, 2019, 12:38 pm

    If you want to look cool (and rich) buy a Tesla but if you want to save our planet buy something like a Mitsubishi Mirage, see https://techmalak.com/mit-study-electric-cars/#.XNRxd9NKjUI

    Reply
    • Mr. Money Mustache May 9, 2019, 1:51 pm

      That little summary has a good point – Teslas come with a large environmental footprint, so like any purchase they are not saving the planet, just destroying it less than an equally sized gas car.

      (although note that the article you shared provided NONE of the underlying numbers/assumptions nor a link to the MIT source materials, so it also might be totally wrong)

      But either way, the difference in my mind is that like many people in this thread, I WANT to give Tesla my money, so they can continue innovating. I could buy some of their next share offering instead, which would be another way to do so indirectly.

      The company started with luxury cars just because those are profitable enough to help them get off the ground, but their real goal is to displace all personal cars, semi trucks, and fossil fuel electric power plants (with the combination of solar+storage).

      For personal virtue, the answer is really easy – just ride a bike and rarely use cars. But to help the planet in a bigger way, you need to help convince the REST of the humans to consume less fossil fuels.

      Reply
      • Ken May 9, 2019, 4:03 pm

        Just want to say that your worldview and your ability to put it into words is refreshing.

        Reply
      • ultrarunner May 9, 2019, 8:09 pm

        This was a huge reason why I bought mine. I’m in a financial position now, after following the MMM ways since 2011, that I could do it easily. It’s the only large purchase of a depreciating asset I’ve ever made that I don’t regret (yet, anyway… it’s only been a year). Was it financially prudent or mustachian? Oh hell no. Not in the slightest bit. But that’s ok.

        PS: I’m in Boulder, if you ever want to drive it, hit me up. ;-)

        Reply
  • EV May 9, 2019, 12:40 pm

    I got a 2019 Leaf for pretty much free. 28k out the door, 10k off for Fed and State Rebates and Incentives, 10k off for bonus depreciation (business vehicle) on the full price, sell for 8k in 3 years. That said, I still like to look at Model 3’s and used Model S’s. It’s just hard justifying 2x the price for a commuter.

    Reply
  • Ryan May 9, 2019, 12:49 pm

    Taming the PJM is a daily challenge, especially when those around me splurge for the latest and greatest. I’ve been pretty good at controlling it, with a few exceptions. First, I’m a sucker for tools and find myself buying tools that would shave mere seconds off my next home improvement project. It’s a sickness, but who doesn’t love a full toolbox? Second, I bought a new Harley-Davidson 2 years ago. I could have gotten one used, but Harley had a new motor that year and I wanted a bike that had never been ridden by another man. Yeh, it was a stupid purchase. But every time I ride that bike the regret is washed away by the beautiful sound of that damned expensive v-twin motor.

    Reply
  • Phil May 9, 2019, 1:05 pm

    My PJM is for a pick-up truck and a Bobcat with all the fun attachments, and it’ll never convince me to buy either. Any lawn work I have can be handled with shovels and wheelbarrows, and I can rent a truck when I need one for less than the cost of 1/3 of one month’s car payment. I tend to kick my PJM all around and don’t let it win.

    I have a 2008 Yaris that gets high-30s for mileage, has 110,000 miles on it, and I’m going to drive it until the Western NY rust eats it apart; hopefully breaking 200k or 250k with it. I did just drop $5k on a 2012 Rav4 for trailer-pulling purchases, which will pay for itself in about two years of saving rentals.

    Where my PJM totally wins is with food. My wife and I are total foodies, and we spend a few hundred bucks a month eating out (and then trying to recreate the meals at home), and the fact is that I have no desire to give up food experimenting, gain substantial happiness from it — so much so that I’m perfectly fine with adding a year or three to my FI date if I get to do that between now and then.

    But I really do want that Bobcat…

    Reply
  • Tom Just Tom May 9, 2019, 1:26 pm

    1. Gotta finish getting out of debt.
    2. Oh, done with getting out of debt except for the mortgage? Don’t want another car payment so I have to save up to pay cash!
    3. I want to put down $50k on a Tesla (no tax rebates until tax time and the gas savings is over, what? 5-6 years)? That would give me $2k a year at a 4% SWR rate for the rest of my life.
    3.5 Or $50k on the principal of my mortgage would also move me closer to retirement; after all, if I retire with debt, I’ll need more income to make the payments. Do I want to silently swoosh down the road or do I want to retire?
    4. Range improves on those suckers every year. I think I’ll wait until next year and see how far those will go.

    But for the rest of you, keep on buying Teslas. I’m about to buy a few shares of stock for the fun of it!

    Reply
  • Nat May 9, 2019, 1:41 pm

    I’ve been making “conditions” for myself for years, and it usually works quite well. I don’t feel “deprived” of the thing I want, although I may decide it’s not worth that much effort to get it!

    “I can’t buy that pretty fabric to make a quilt, until I finish sewing this other quilt.” (Usual result: progress on the existing quilt, and I lose interest in the new fabric, so I don’t buy it, but I also don’t feel bad. And sometimes I do finish the quilt and buy the fabric.)

    “I want to get bees. But I have to finish building shelves for the house I can build a beehive.” (We now have bookshelves and closet shelves and storage room shelves and I’m working on living room shelves. No longer sure about the bees, though.)

    It doesn’t always involve money, either: “I have to pick up the living room before I can get that book from the library.” (Usual result: relaxing with the book in the now-clean living room.)

    Reply
  • Madison May 9, 2019, 1:43 pm

    This was perfectly timed for me as I’ve also been pining for a Tesla. Especially after watching CGP Grey’s road trip video yesterday (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_naDg-guomA).

    Thank you for keeping me from that ‘buy’ button!

    Reply
  • Sander May 9, 2019, 1:43 pm

    Total cumulative traffic deaths in the 20th century: about 25 million. After the year 2000, about 1.2 million per year. That’s about 50 million deaths in all attributable to cars. For every person killed, about 25 are injured. Cars are truly evil, whether they run on gas or electricity.

    Reply
    • Mr. Money Mustache May 10, 2019, 8:50 am

      .. and you could take this even further – for every person injured, how many people are permanently crippled or have their happiness reduced due to lifestyle diseases caused by not getting enough outdoor walking in? Plus the amount we waste on land and asphalt for roads, and so on.

      You are right, personal cars are silly within cities. But this article is not about city design – check the list of all articles if you want to read about that separately! :-)

      Reply
  • Brent a Schmierbach May 9, 2019, 1:46 pm

    My PJM is, too, pushing me to read all of the specs and accolades for a Tesla. After all, it’s a cheaper TCO than a loaded Camry or Prius…except I’ve never considered buying a Camry/Prius/Accord. I bought a used 2014 Leaf two years ago. It only had 29,000 miles on it and I got it for $8,500 (with zero maintenance since. It’s cheaper than any car on the road, given those two facts. That said, it’s a total pain in the ass (to find a dealership 440v charging and wait to charge) if I have to make even an 80-mile round trip. So I tell my PJM to wait. Teslas are amazing, but only getting BETTER (and cheaper since I only buy used).

    Reply
  • mcguinness May 9, 2019, 2:00 pm

    Tesla’s are not a great purchase in my particular city as our grid is currently 50% coal (and currently replacing coal generation with natural gas generation because that seems much more sensible to burn natural gas rather than ship the electricity via transmission lines which lead to efficiency losses and why don’t we all just have natural gas generators at our houses instead because it would be more efficient or just go nuclear already::: end rant) so really, a Tesla is coal powered here where I live and this will be the case for the next 5 years.

    Besides – Cars are objectively awful – they’re noisy (yes even the electric ones because they push so much air around when they move at high speeds), they leak oil (unless they are electric), their existence demands the use of additional fossil fuels due to the fossil fuels involved in road production/maintenance, they very easily kill and maim people, and they are bad for the very drivers who use them. I understand the need for them to some degree given the expectations of modern society and say, for people with mobility issues or in case of emergencies, but for the most part they are more trouble than they are worth.

    Paint it that way and you’ll never want to buy a car.

    Reply
  • Bharath May 9, 2019, 2:17 pm

    I apologize if this question is too intruding. This blog has a few links to items I think I can use . How do I differentiate opinion vs sponsors

    Reply
    • Mr. Money Mustache May 9, 2019, 3:03 pm

      Thanks for checking on me Bharath – everything is my opinion and I have never done any sponsored posts or items. But I use Amazon affiliate links when possible, so the blog earns a ~6% commission if you do buy those recommended faucets or track lights or whatever. No affiliation to Tesla though unfortunately :-)

      Reply
  • Adam May 9, 2019, 2:41 pm

    My PJM is constantly working overtime. Current targets:

    * A Tern GSD (probably going to get purchased within the next month or two, if I’m honest). Justifications: the kid doesn’t fit into a Yepp Mini anymore, and I don’t have a step-through bike, so I’m not keen on mounting a kid seat on the rear rack. Also, the range is insane, and you can carry so much stuff. Plus it feels like science-fiction to ride. On the other hand: it costs as much as a used car :(

    * A Gameboy Advance. Justifications: I could play video games again, without in-app purchases, ads, or sub-par Android gaming experience. 15 hour battery life off two AA batteries. Retro gaming goodness. On the other hand: I have basically no time for playing video games. Buying the cartridges isn’t cheap.

    * A Brompton H6R with dynamo-hub lighting and an Alfine 11 speed hub. Justifications: I’d never have to charge bike lights again, and I’d never run out of gears. On the other hand: you already have a Brompton dude. You just don’t like the color. You could save up and add a dynamo or the 11 speed hub to the bike you already own.

    Reply
  • Biggsie May 9, 2019, 2:41 pm

    OK but how about the justification cycle for a $7,000 electric cargo bike, e.g. Yuba Supermarché? We live about 500′ higher and 1.5 miles from our town (schools, stores) with an average grade of 5% and some spots hitting 10+%.

    Living right in town costs 30-50% more so it’s just not possible for us. Box-style electric cargo bikes are the best option for two kids + groceries but they’re just coming on the market and there are virtually none to be found used. Commute is already <3 miles for both me, wife and kids school.

    Is reduced car usage, exercise, fresh air, connection with kiddos and all around good vibes worth it?

    Reply
    • Mr. Money Mustache May 9, 2019, 2:46 pm

      Electric bikes are great! But there is no reason they need to cost anything close to that – Yubas and such just have a gigantic profit margin.

      Check this bike out that I’m currently enjoying at HQ: https://www.instagram.com/p/Bw-MvS3jpgf/

      It’s a Bunch bike Swift, electric assist with a 500W motor and BIG battery. I was able to override the controller so it can hit 25MPH (although you need to change the gearing to make this work properly, coming soon! I think they are about $2k..

      Reply
      • Biggsie May 9, 2019, 3:50 pm

        Great tip! Hadn’t seen those. How does the motor fare on steep hills with a heavy load? I’ve heard hub-drive motors have issues hence the move to (more expensive) crank-drive (e.g. Bosch.)

        Reply
        • Mr. Money Mustache November 19, 2019, 5:17 pm

          After trying/owning lots of bikes with both hub and mid-drive motors, I still find hubs are the best. Even this heavy minivan of a cargo bike has PLENTY of torque to get up the steepest hill.

          I made a higher performance mountain bike with a 1300 watt mid-drive motor, and I have now broken two chains and had the chain fall off repeatedly during vigorous acceleration and stunts, just because there is more strain on it with a motor driving the chain along with my 750 watt legs.

          So yeah, hub drive all the way for practical use around the city!

          Reply
  • SHeather May 9, 2019, 2:49 pm

    Hello from a long-time MMM reader in the UK. If I needed a car I would love a Tesla or the best electric vehicle around when we need / can justify car ownership. My kitchen LOL! Would love to update an over 15 yr old setup. So far replaced the corroded leaky tap/ faucet myself. Fan/vent above the gas hobs is just recirculating into it’s own cupboard instead of to the outside world and I want to fix this but may wait until I sort the whole kitchen. Priorities include remortgage in a few months (after a short fixed rate ends) so no major spends until that’s sorted and then a proper ladder and hatch into loft so we can insulate it better and use for storage without breaking limbs/ working tag-team with someone holding a ladder. All this to say thanks for another great post and I should get off my arse and grease the creaky door hinge before getting more ambitious! Nice idea of opposing saving and spending machines helping us to make decisions and think it can help those who think stoicism too hardcore. I mean as a starting point as obviously it goes hand in hand with those ideas but as a way to convince spendy people who want it all now.

    Reply
  • Takara May 9, 2019, 3:11 pm

    My PJM is working me for a second dog and a house. I think both of these can become reasonable, but I need to get things in order first. I like the idea of using it for motivation! I just have to keep it top of mind and not feel like I’m just denying myself.

    Reply
  • Dharma Bum May 9, 2019, 3:12 pm

    I want a condo in Telluride, Colorado.

    PJM is telling me:
    I can pay cash
    I would have plenty cash left over to stay retired
    I ski at least 4 weeks a year
    I’m pushing 60, not getting any younger, and won’t be able to ski forever
    I can use it during the beautiful Colorado summers too
    I won’t have to pay for hotels anymore
    I can get a season’s ski pass and save even more money

    REALITY is telling me:
    I can just rent a condo when I want to and get the exact same benefit with zero commitment

    Whew!

    Thanks reality.

    Reply
  • Sheila Gray May 9, 2019, 3:38 pm

    So.. A Tesla can be used for more than a commute… I met with a Tesla owner who installed a mattress in the back with the seat down and uses it instead of a hotel while on road trips. You can run the ac/heat off of the battery without moving anywhere. He and his wife enjoyed their freedom on the road.

    Reply
  • ECRacer May 9, 2019, 3:39 pm

    My PJM has been telling me to buy noise cancelling headphones. I work as a software engineer but share space with the hardware folk who are always running noisy tests to test their creations. For example, there is a large spindle in front of a bar code reading camera that is spinning pretty fast (2-3 revs a second) all day and night. This can be distracting. I tell myself that I can focus just fine though with the ear phones that came with my iPhone, so I am able to resist.

    I am also itching to replace my iPhone SE because the battery won’t last me a full day of use. I was looking at phones with larger batteries like the Motorolla G7 Power. Then I thought what MMM would think and I found a case that has a large ass battery built in that would solve my problem for 20 bucks from Amazon. Definitely able to resist upgrading my phone because of that :)

    Reply

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